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    1. #1
      Member McWill's Avatar
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      help with turtling

      hey,
      please don't bite my head off here, i am new to rts ^^
      Sorry if its already been asked but i'm having problems with players who turtle, particularly protoss players.
      for e.g. you scout there base and see that they are building alot of photon cannons usually followed by a few stargates. you know they are going for mass voidrays but how do you stop it?
      any early attack i make on there base is swiftly ended by cannons, and any attempt i make at denying them there expansion is ended as soon as the first few voidrays are completed.
      i usually play toss myself in 2v2's.
      thanks in advance
      - Will

    2. #2
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      Heya,

      Rather than try and beat down his wall, try creating units that counter his voids like phoenixes or vikings. Building a photon wall like that does have some disadvantages. His firepower isn't mobile at all. So at the cost of a large ground army to overcome the cannons, you should pin him down with a few ground units and spend the rest of your cash getting ready to take down that air force. Also consider that after you've boxed him in, you will be able to expand and he wont. Just make sure you can handle the voids first. With a hard counter, this shouldn't be too hard though.

      -Romeo

    3. #3
      Moderator Moderas's Avatar
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      Another possibility would be to warp prism some guys in to his base. With that many cannons at the front he likely does not have any defense near his minerals or tech buildings.
      Add me: Moderas character code: 933

      "I wish I was your derivative, so that I could lie tangent to your curves." Physics jokes ftw

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      Senior Member Sillierabbit's Avatar
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      If you are protoss playing turtling VR I suggest blink stalkers. If you don't pressure your opponent well enough, he will reach a critical mass of VR then it will be near impossible to stop. Best thing to do is just mass blink stalkers. Blink stalkers give you mobility and ability to take out the VR in a quick way. If he masses VR, don't mass phoenix. In the end, phoenixes can't win the game for you. Carriers are hard countered by VR as well. So the only logical choice is either VRs yourself or stalkers. Stalkers also allow you to put pressure on him when he is ramping up his economy. If he is getting a lot of cannons, just get one observer and find an undefended ledge. Or if it's defended by a cannon or two, get enough stalkers to handle it. Your observer will always be able to see the cannons without being fired upon if you are careful. A group of 10-18 stalkers with blink can easily ravage his base. And remember to target pylons when you see cannons. I think a 2-3 attack timing window is the max if he's going to get purely VR.

    5. #5
      Member McWill's Avatar
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      hey,
      thanks for the quick replies. I haven't had a chance to test your solutions yet but will be sure too next time i see 15 photon cannons

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      I know you don't play Zerg, but this is what makes Brood Lords so powerful. They are turtle busters.

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      Ah, a local from Columbia. I'm from Rockville!

    8. #8
      Member McWill's Avatar
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      greetings,
      i'm now quite confident at stopping voidray spam but i have ran into some new problems.
      i have recently been promoted to join the sc2 elites in the erm.. silver league...
      first, i'm having a real problem getting past the terran blockade on there ramp. i played an hour long game earlier where i sent wave after wave at some guys blockade but just couldn't get through for the life of me. i cast feedback on his medivacs, psy storm on the marines, used sentries for shields and zealots as fodder... he had quite alot of missile turrets so i didn't bother with colossus or air units.
      i did eventually win, but not before i almost completely mined every expansion on the map other than his natural and the island (scrap station) which seems like a ridiculous amount of effort for who was clearly a worse player.
      any tips on how to break it down easier?


      also in PvP, is a 4gate the way to go?
      i scouted early gas and spotted 2 gateways being built really fast. i assumed this ment he was going to mass some stalkers so i went for a 2gate robo for some immortals.. he got 2 more gateways and then surely enough i was rushed with stalkers and even though i was taking ~3 stalkers for every immortal, he just had way more units than i so i was completely overwhelmed.
      if i stick to a 4gate i usually win, but loose whenever i try anything else :S

    9. #9
      Moderator Moderas's Avatar
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      I will answer the second question first, as it is easier. The 4 gate push is a good strategy in all match ups at all times until Platinum when maybe 50% of the people you play will know how to counter it. As Day9 once said, if a Protoss were determined enough he could 4 gate his way to 1700 (or was it 1500?) Diamond. In addition to that, if someone ever tries to 4 gate you I would suggest using the "Korean 4 gate". You can find a few good videos of it on Youtube including one of Tester beating HuK with it.

      For the first question, a true Terran turtle can be very hard to beat. Some things to think about if he turtles are
      -He has all his defense up front so he is likely weak to harass
      -He is far more limited on resources than you are and is not scouting, so you will always have surprise on your side
      -Use air units/colossus to give you sight so you can fight back
      -USE RANGE TO YOUR ADVANTAGE!!!! Other than Siege Tanks, an upgraded colossus has a greater range than any Terran unit. Blink a couple stalkers up to take down those tanks and then eat his marines while they cant fight back.

      Hope this helps
      Add me: Moderas character code: 933

      "I wish I was your derivative, so that I could lie tangent to your curves." Physics jokes ftw

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      Junior Member coolsmelly's Avatar
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      I played a toss turtler a few days ago who was teching up to dt.
      The game started with me 8 pooling him (I've got an 8 pool build order that is by no means all in, but it does slow my econ a little) and losing a few lings because he had a forge and 2 cannons and no gateway, all built very close to his nexus. The map was Steppes of War, I think. So I returned my attention to my base and kept sending lings to the top of his ramp, keeping him boxed in his base. While he teched up (to something I couldn't really see) I just teched up to lair and hydras, then upgraded some overlords to overseers, and made a creep highway with my remaining ovies and took that turtle down because all he sent at me was dt's. Because he boxed in his nexus and mineral line, he had no space back there for w-gates, and had to build them at the front of his base. I had expanded at around 22 supply and had two queens so I was pumping out hydras so fast, I just took out his pylons powering his cannons after I unpowered his wgates and the rest is history. Turtling screws you up too bad.

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