+ Reply to Thread + Post New Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 11 to 18 of 18

Thread: Zerg - How to counter mass Hydras?
  • Share This Thread!
    • Share on Facebook
    1. #11
      Senior Member NightlyNews's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 2010
      Location
      Philly
      Posts
      165
      Downloads
      71
      Uploads
      8
      I don't know about you, but I have never played a zvz that got to hive tech. Except once when my friend and I were just starting, but that was because we both had 8+ spine crawlers and any normal game could never get that high tech.

      I'm sticking to my guns on this infestors have no place in zvz unless they are being really annoying with mutas.

      But, if you can make it work hey don't change your build because of me. I just don't suggest skewing your build to work em in.
      Why my name is NightlyNews ---> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/03/slow-jam-the-news-jimmy-f_n_830759.html
      ID: Brian (1312)

    2. #12
      Junior Member JuiceBox's Avatar
      Join Date
      Dec 2010
      Location
      canada, alberta
      Posts
      20
      Downloads
      0
      Uploads
      0
      for that i would go roach and banling, but i would upgrade burrow so the roaches health regen faster

    3. #13
      Super Moderator OneManZerg's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 2010
      Posts
      234
      Downloads
      15
      Uploads
      11
      So...

      Little bit of caveat. A good commander can find scenarios where his army will beat another superior army. That is, if I have a couple infestors I can neutralize Roaches, lings or banelings. OR, I can soften up your larger group of Hydras. Or I can split your army and fight only part of it at a time or force you out of position. Now, add in terrain imbalances, choke points, reinforcement timing and you have a whole new set of 1,000 variables that can change things... All that said, here's MY perspective on ZvZ army compositions.

      Here's your breakdown... (according to me)

      ling < speedling

      speedling < baneling

      Baneling < Roach

      Tier 1.5 (ling, bane roach) < Mutalisk OR infestor (can't attack air OR can't beat fungal)

      Hydra < Roach

      Roach < Hydra / Infestor

      Roach get PWNED by this cuz they never get to attack hydralisk 5 or 6 attack range, roach only 4

      Roach < Roach / Hydra (what you get is what flamga said. One line of roaches attacking one line of roaches supported by 2-3 lines of hydras... simple math says 1 line < multiple lines)

      Mutalisk < Infestor (with appropriate control - huge caveat)

      Mutalisk < Hydralisk

      hydralisks < banelings (in sufficient numbers - hydras are light units, banelings own light and have splash)

      So, if your opponent is going mass hydralisks you can go roach/hydra. You can go roach/bane. You can go roach/infestor. You can go roach/hydra/infestor. All those combos SHOULD beat them... but then once again you get to the last key to the equation - commanding your troops in the battle.

      Best of luck Kushakd. =)
      OneManZerg - 971

    4. #14
      Senior Member smagee's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 2010
      Location
      San Jose, CA
      Posts
      256
      Downloads
      39
      Uploads
      21
      An interesting addendum to OMZ's list here is that despite the fact that Infestors can lock Roaches down and prevent them from doing anything useful, AFAIK, the roaches can still burrow (assuming it's been researched). They can't go anywhere and they will still be revealed to any units around, but due to their insane regen rate when burrowed, they stand a better chance in that state than they do exposed up aboveground.
      -smagee (#948), GMT -8

    5. #15
      Senior Member NightlyNews's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 2010
      Location
      Philly
      Posts
      165
      Downloads
      71
      Uploads
      8
      My problem with all these are they are theoretical.

      OMZ do you really believe your infestor hydra would beat mass roach. Cause honestly there is a HUGE window where a player can just come in and wipe you with about 15 roaches or hell even just mass ling. Let's 1v1 with those builds lol.

      The reason people say they hate the term counter is because this isn't a game where you just start with units. Yes obviously roach hydra beats roach (in large numbers) and infestor hydra decimates roach. I'm not arguing infestors aren't good I'm arguing you'll get your ass killed teching to them against an equally skilled opponent.

    6. #16
      Moderator Flamga's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Adelaide, Australia
      Posts
      653
      Downloads
      46
      Uploads
      13
      Quote Originally Posted by NightlyNews View Post
      My problem with all these are they are theoretical.

      OMZ do you really believe your infestor hydra would beat mass roach. Cause honestly there is a HUGE window where a player can just come in and wipe you with about 15 roaches or hell even just mass ling. Let's 1v1 with those builds lol.

      The reason people say they hate the term counter is because this isn't a game where you just start with units. Yes obviously roach hydra beats roach (in large numbers) and infestor hydra decimates roach. I'm not arguing infestors aren't good I'm arguing you'll get your ass killed teching to them against an equally skilled opponent.
      If you were to go hydra infestor then you likely have some plan to get there, maybe roach to defend but not when you get lair tech. yes I do agree but when you chose to do a build that requires to get to a certain tech, the build starts off you surviving till you get that tech. And hydra infestor isnt that hard to get to, comparing to mutalisk, or roach hydra, which if infestors are used properly the hydra will literally rape them.

      It should also be noted that teching for zerg is easier than any other race as its easy to have the minerals and gas laying around to get the infestation pit early, seeing as when you have lair tech youll likely have 2-3 bases.
      The mind is both willing and able, the hands are too busy reaching for the beer bottle..... Add me on the SEA and NA servers: Flamga #377

      GMT +10.5!

    7. #17
      Super Moderator OneManZerg's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 2010
      Posts
      234
      Downloads
      15
      Uploads
      11
      well, now the question has changed...

      Are you asking me what beats mass roach? Or are you asking me what beats a mass roach build? Ah-hah! now there is the difference.

      What beats a mass roach build are some quick lings to test their front or a fast expo with some spines and queens to secure macro control. Also, on a larger map you can quick tech muta and own up on their roaches (that is depending on when they push out).

      So... there are windows to beat mass roach just as mass roach has windows to beat tech... So... now I'm wondering... what is the real question? =)

      edit: and then I looked at the post... and it's about what beats mass hydras. hahaha. Well, I think all of this conversation has been good conversation
      Last edited by OneManZerg; 12-31-2010 at 05:13 PM.
      OneManZerg - 971

    8. #18
      Senior Member NightlyNews's Avatar
      Join Date
      Oct 2010
      Location
      Philly
      Posts
      165
      Downloads
      71
      Uploads
      8
      Yea my from the base question I read it as how to play zvz and many players even at the semi-pro level get by with just lings roaches and queens.

      Especially at the low levels if your using your money and storm in with +1 roaches instead of going to infestor or massing hydras or something that will easily get you to platinum.

      We've actually played a game like this OMZ. I was much worse at the time or my evo chamber would have been up and I would have had another queen. Basically I'm saying most of the time rushing to mutas or something won't work. I'm pretty sure I just stormed your main with 6 roaches and got a queen and at least an equal number of drones before your mutas could clean me up.

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts