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Thread: SCVRush vs OneManZerg
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    1. #1
      Super Moderator OneManZerg's Avatar
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      SCVRush vs OneManZerg

      Hey everyone,

      As you may know from our front page post, SCVRush and OneManZerg have faced off.

      I invite everyone to visit this link and give their feedback to these matches before reading further (especially if they don't know the outcome)
      I think that both of us did display the same or similar strategy repeatedly but I think the reason for that is that we had strong beliefs in our strategies - whether or not they worked out. You can see that my fast expands while giving me extra life and breadth in many games they also led to the demise of myself in two of the 3 games I fast expanded where as the more methodical, standard builds might have left me in a better position in those games.

      However, if you take the counter, if I did not fast expand I may have been in a worse position in those other games and have lost. All in all you can see that Zerg fast expands led to a 2-1 win ratio where as a more normal, slower, standard (14/15 pool then extractor, kinda) led to a 1-1 win ratio. As in almost all SC 2 games there is really no point where the game was "won" or "lost" but there are points where the games could have turned tides into another persons favor. I hope you guys enjoyed these games and watching all of us as we definitely enjoyed playing them and I hope this can promote our league and competition across all levels (Bronze to diamond) as that is what TheUEN.com was made for - to promote the learning and improvement of SC 2 players across all levels.

      Thanks for tuning in for those who were able to and once again for those who weren't visit this link: Live Show [Procaster] Tue Nov 30 2010 11:01:45 PM on theuentv - live streaming video powered by Livestream to see the replays of our matches cast by Smagee, Flamga and Moderas who all deserve a big shoutout and thanks for TheUEN community for taking their time and energy to cast this long series.

      Thanks again to Moderas, Smagee and Flamga and to everyone who attended the livecast - a new high of 50+ viewers on our livecast!

      -OneManZerg
      OneManZerg - 971

    2. #2
      Senior Member smagee's Avatar
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      Excellent games, very nice play on both sides, and I agree with OMZ's assessment (which you can hear more about during the commentary). While both players appeared to stick with fairly similar strategies in all 5 games (OMZ perhaps more so, with the exception of one match), I think this very fact provides an excellent demonstration of the power of map choice. The final match could have been drastically different if it had been played on Xel'Naga Caverns, as originally scheduled. The fact that Zerg (and perhaps OMZ in particular) is granted a tremendous advantage on Scrap Station proved to be huge in the final game.

      Beyond those notes, each game (particularly the wins by SCV) provide an excellent example of how even a small number of terran units can do massive amounts of damage in the early game to a macro-heavy Zerg player. The fact that SCVRush knew OMZ's tendency to fast expand allowed him to quickly take the advantage in both his quick wins; in fact, the one time OMZ went fast pool was coincidentally the one time that he was able to fend off the early push.

      One thing that I think people should try to take out of these games: the value of creep spread. OMZ is easily one of the best players I've ever seen at ensuring that creep is *everywhere*. He'd likely be the first to point out that focusing on spread comes at the cost of other small micro abilities, but having that vision and speed across the map is absolutely huge, as we saw in the battle for Scrap Station. These benefits (generally) far outweigh the cost. Zerg players remember: it never hurts to have a dedicated creeping queen!

      One thing to note: after the stream finished, several of us joined up on Ventrilo with the competitors for a quick Q&A session; in the future, we'll try to do this as part of the stream so that it gets appropriately archived, but for now, if anyone has any questions they don't have addressed already, feel free to post them up in this thread and I'm sure OMZ and SCV will be happy to accommodate.
      -smagee (#948), GMT -8

    3. #3
      Senior Member NightlyNews's Avatar
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      I can't get it to play :/

      Anyone else having a problem getting by the advertisements?

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      Member DerKleBesTiF's Avatar
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      I've missed the first match, but even without that first match, I can say that the APM was heated up in the roof, like the 4 others.

      Great players, great matches. Watching those LiveCast was nothing compared to this Live Match between these 2 beasts. Important macro and micro playing from both player made the match SO alive. It has a lack of originality. During those 5 matches, strategies were changing, but the units selected for those moves was exactly the same, execpt for OMZ at the last match, which used Roaches.

      Those kind of event are so addictive to watch. I've bring 3 of my team mates to watch this out by sayin' : "Take Notes!". One of em' said ; "If OMZ wins, I go back Zerg. ( Currently Terran Player ). I seriously don't know what he's going to do, but, one thing is sure ; We want MOAR of those live events.

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      nerf zerg!

    6. #6
      Senior Member smagee's Avatar
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      NightlyNews: Not sure what the issue is; tested the replay last night after it had finished uploading and it played fine for me. Anyone else noticing this?

      DerKleBesTiF: First, I had to copy-paste that name because I'm too damn lazy to type it; kudos ! I swapped to the APM tab a couple of times out of curiosity, but generally tried to stick to Production. That said, the game that I recall checking late-game, both players were hovering somewhere in the range of 100-150APM, so yeah, I think they were doing well .

      Incidentally, your "lack of originality" comment could come across as criticism, while I'm not sure that's entirely what you intended. I think the very fact that they followed similar builds each time helps the viewer identify just how much of a difference map, position, scouting, etc. makes by ensuring that those are the only variables tracked.

      Note to all: I'll post the replays when I get home this evening (assuming someone else doesn't by then) unless either of the competitors objects for some reason. I completely forgot to do so last night.
      Last edited by smagee; 12-01-2010 at 11:49 AM.
      -smagee (#948), GMT -8

    7. #7
      Member DerKleBesTiF's Avatar
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      I didn't intend that as a criticism. I take it as a personnal lesson. In matches, I'm trying to get more units, to have the "originality" fact. But those guys showed us how useless the originality is, during a match, it all depends about the map, scouting, position, like you said. Of course, you have to choose the right build to fight against another's one, but that Live Match prooved us that you don't need to get to Top Tier units as fast as some people may think.

      I've did a 2vs2 match with my Team Mate, and one of them suddenly jumped from Zergling to Brood Lord, which was pretty useless - Because we already had some heavy anti-air.

      So yeah!~ I personally think that events like that gives a boost in people's knowledge, on what to do, and what not-to do.
      ( Yeh, I know, My nickname is quite hard to type, but you'll get it soon or later )

      DerKleBesTiF - 233 - (GMT-5)
      Quote Originally Posted by OneManZerg View Post
      *Moderas writes off the Pokemon Theme song*
      Moderas, you might lose moderator status with comments like that. hahahah =p

    8. #8
      Senior Member smagee's Avatar
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      I didn't intend that as a criticism. I take it as a personnal lesson.
      That's what I thought, just wanted to clarify.

      ( Yeh, I know, My nickname is quite hard to type, but you'll get it soon or later )
      You, sir, are underestimating my laziness. I've actually already resolved to call you DerK .
      -smagee (#948), GMT -8

    9. #9
      Member DerKleBesTiF's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by smagee View Post
      You, sir, are underestimating my laziness. I've actually already resolved to call you DerK .
      Hahaha, That's fine to me!

      DerKleBesTiF - 233 - (GMT-5)
      Quote Originally Posted by OneManZerg View Post
      *Moderas writes off the Pokemon Theme song*
      Moderas, you might lose moderator status with comments like that. hahahah =p

    10. #10
      Senior Member Lemanruss's Avatar
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      Can you upload those games to the replays section? pretty pretty please with cream and strawberry on top.

      I'm watching the livestream, but the download of the file allows to go back and forward easily, check the units they have at all times, and all that kind of stuff.
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------
      add me as your friend...or foe ;)
      LemanRuss #105 :: USA
      LemanRuss #618 :: EU GMT

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