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Thread: DreamHack...*spoilers*
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    1. #1
      Member McWill's Avatar
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      DreamHack...*spoilers*

      sorry if there is already a topic for this but i cant see it, feel free to delete this if there is.
      anyone been watching?

      its basically been one huge cheese fest.
      action Jesus gets through on 6/7pools alone.
      HuK looses 2-1 to Socke. he won with a cannon rush and lost twice to 4gate ( the mothership makes an appearance too in the group stages)
      seen a few successful drone and cannon rushes and some all-in 1base play aswell.
      White-Ra, TLO and HuK eliminated, i was sure we'd see two of them in the final aswell O.o
      Tyler is still in i think so its probably still worth watching.

      people who have defended cheese (myself included) often do so on the basis its easy to counter if you see it coming. but its really dominated this tournament and some VERY high level players have lost too it... a fluke, or do you think some balancing may be in order.

      McWill 243 - EU

    2. #2
      Moderator Flamga's Avatar
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      Well I think at that high level of play most people wouldnt expect it, and/or they think its beneath players of that level. However I belive that makes them even more potent, and by doing it you throw your opponent off his whole game. Imagine if you get cheesed and lose first game, youll panic the rest thinking i she going to do it again.

      They are valid strategies, however it takes more than that to get up high consistently. However I suppose we will see what happens then shall we

      Also this maybe a stupid question but where can I watch these games? lol I think I missed that, and also is it just the replays or full commentaries etc?
      The mind is both willing and able, the hands are too busy reaching for the beer bottle..... Add me on the SEA and NA servers: Flamga #377

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      Moderator Redux0718's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Flamga View Post

      They are valid strategies, however it takes more than that to get up high consistently. However I suppose we will see what happens then shall we

      Also this maybe a stupid question but where can I watch these games? lol I think I missed that, and also is it just the replays or full commentaries etc?

      True, cheeses are valid strategies but it takes WAY more than that to become a korean level progamer

      As for the matches, you may watch replays of them in day9's streams: blip.tv (since 2005)
      LanEvoIII #988

      Feel free to add me though I have not played multiplayer yet and I have not been placed yet. I will play my placement matches after my college studies (almost done).


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      Member McWill's Avatar
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      although only 1 korean pro remains here D:
      cheese is a valid strategy but i think it should be much more of a rare tactic that only works if it catches people offguard when they go nexus/CC first or something greedy like that. it should be much more of a gamble than it is, Action jesus was microing his lings pretty well to deadly effect against solid openings and its a shame how well it worked. watching 6pools and 4gates dominate a tournament with some very skilled players is outright embarrassing. (although it does make me feel a little better for still loosing to cheese myself :P)

      McWill 243 - EU

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      Moderator Moderas's Avatar
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      The 6 pool gets more deadly as you get higher level. You get so comfortable with your standard builds that it can really rock you. As for the 4 gate... that build needs nerfed. I honestly do not have a problem with it at all anymore, but it is retarded that it is stupid easy to pull off and can literally bring you to 1800+ diamond. Just the possibility that a protoss might 4 gate requires me to go 3 rax before tech.
      Add me: Moderas character code: 933

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    6. #6
      Member McWill's Avatar
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      yeh indeed. I'm not sure what they can really do about it though. but cheese is just too powerful atm i think.

      just lost to a marine scv rush all in, first time i've been against it (guess people have been inspired to cheese after dreamhack?) not sure what i could have done about it :/ (steps of war) i chronoboosted a sentry as fast as i could instead of getting warpgate +stalker. used force field the instant it warped in but half there army was already in my base. zealots just aren't any match for marines if they are surrounded by scv's. lost all my probes holding it. second wave finished me fml :'(

      anyhow, the finals were epic worth a watch.
      can watch most of the vids on day9's site (link above) but he hasn't finished uploading them all yet.

      McWill 243 - EU

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      I've won plenty of games with mass marines even won against a diamond player with it.
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    8. #8
      Junior Member inSpire's Avatar
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      Cheese is and always will be a part of the game. Some people are outraged when in fact they have been cheesed and call you noob, bad player, etc. There are many different cheese strategies as everyone already knows, so why fix something that's not broken?

    9. #9
      Senior Member smagee's Avatar
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      The fact that cheese does and always will exist doesn't mean that it should be as easy or potent as it currently is. Although I haven't been cheesed myself lately (haven't played enough these days), I can understand the frustration of a progamer or even someone in high-plat or diamond leagues losing a match where they *saw* the cheese coming and still couldn't stop it. If someone of that caliber does everything right and still loses (as we see in some of the dreamhack games), it implies that something could be repaired. This is precisely the same reasoning that was used to nerf reapers (and then nerf them again), although whether that nerfing was necessary is a different debate.
      -smagee (#948), GMT -8

    10. #10
      Senior Member NightlyNews's Avatar
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      I think it's just the style of game we are going through.

      First people got really greedy and started 14 hatch 2 rax or forge expanding every bloody game, so the natural counter to bring them down to earth is cheese. However, once people go back to normal builds these cheese games will die out because they simply can't hold up.

      Also, Huk has been aware that he was susceptible to cheese. He said in some cast that in one tournament he never got a gate before 14-15 and was surprised no one hit him early on.

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